Halo 4

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Halo 4

Post by Vigil on Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:31 am

For over a 3 months I kept calling Glasslands 'Grasslands.' as well.

I had it since last Christmas and I still haven't read it. I've only read about a third of Cryptum, then I forgot about it.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by Nocbl2 on Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:08 pm

Both are very good books, and add tons of context to H4. I think the Thursday War and the third Forerunner book may help too.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:36 pm

Rasq'uire'laskar wrote:
KristallNacht wrote:well there aren't brutes, so why have brute weapons? The needle rifle was just another dmr weapon anyway, grenade launcher is better as the sticky detonator.
The needle rifle is distinct from the DMR in that it is a three-shot-kill weapon wherever you hit an opponent, but is useless against vehicles.
I feel that they could have made the Needle Rifle even more distinct in Halo 4 by including more unshielded enemies and removing the Light Rifle/DMR.

KristallNacht wrote:In general about the 'uniqueness' there are really only so many types of weapons in real life too.
Which completely ignores the fact that we're talking about Covenant and Forerunner weapons as well. Different technology is going to lead to different weapons... otherwise, we'd still be fighting with spears and clubs.

I mean in firearms. you get your precision fast, your precision powerful, your hose, and your spray. If it's so easy, make some right now.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Angatar on Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:15 pm

I don't think anyone said it was easy, NT. The thing about the Forerunner weapons is that there isn't really a difference between them and their UNSC/Storm counterparts, when they could have made bigger difference.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:48 pm

examples?

Sure, idk if they really NEEDED new weapons, but you're acting like weapons from Painkiller would be more appropriate.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Vigil on Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:45 am

KristallNacht wrote:examples?

Sure, idk if they really NEEDED new weapons, but you're acting like weapons from Painkiller would be more appropriate.

I think you're missing the point.

Human and Covenant weapons, while similar usually have very different applications.

Plasma pistols are mainly used for overcharged shots, while it's human counterpart is used as a mid range headshot weapon.

The Needler is nothing like the assault rifle and has the unique supercombine effect.

The Energy Sword and Shotgun fill the same instant kill up close weapon role, but the sword has the significant lunge to it, while the shotgun usually needs to be fired almost point blank to be an instant kill.

The Carbine/Needler rifle are semi-automatic and trade firing faster for the spread of the BR/ raw bullet power of the DMR.

The Fuel Rod Cannon and rocket lanucher while they are both high damage heavy weapons, the fuel rod shoots can bounce in transit. The Plasma launcher was even more different with 4 lock projectiles per shot that while slow, would cause devestating damage if it hit it's target.

UNSC Sniper compared to the Beam rifle was also a key difference. You have 4 shots in the human rifle, and about 3 in the beam if you timed your shots before an overheat. The difference was the beam rifle could fire absurdly quickly after the first shot, which could kill an enemy before they could react, at the cost of an expensive overheat.

Even the brute weapons had different properties to their human and Covenant counterparts. The mauler while similar to a shotgun, the fact you could dual wield it made it a powerful super close range weapon. The Grenade launcher and brute shot were very different.

But the Promethean weapons aren't all that different. The sniper is not that different to the UNSC one. The shotgun has some mid-range spread, but it's mainly going to be used exactly like the UNSC one. The rifle is a mix of the DMR and the carbine.

They seemed to have played it safe with the weapons and didn't really do anything new with them.


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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:19 am

....wait so simple balancing is most of those....and the Binary Rifle is balanced differently than the sniper and the beam rifle. that makes it equally as different as the carbine, dmr, br are. The mauler was nothing more than a weak ass shotgun. the differences between the rocket launcher, fuel rod, and plasma launcher are represented equally in the incineration cannon. The scatter shots bullets bounce off walls. the light rifle is another balance, mainly to give loadouts a variety and acknowledge that there would be a need for such a weapon in a society.

You act as if the basic needs in a weapon are going to be different for no fucking reason whatsoever. Why exactly would prometheans NOT have these weapons as they are? Why would they definitely have something else?
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Angatar on Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:16 pm

They could fill the same role in a different manner. Like the Focus Rifle to the Sniper Rifle in Reach, or FRG to Rocket Launcher in CE, or Energy Sword to Gravity Hammer in 3, very different weapons can fill the same role.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:45 pm

so what you do is latch onto the very few weapons that are truly different and ignore the fact that most of the weapons that have existed in the story were only balanced differently?

tbh, the focus rifle was fucking stupid and impractical.

once again, why wouldn't the prometheans have these weapons, and why would they have something else, and what could that something else be?
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Re: Halo 4

Post by CivBase on Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:28 pm

I think the concern is simply that, in previous installments, weapons usually had genuinely unique application and play style. Halo 4's new weapons don't seem to have that same individuality; they feel like re-textured versions of existing weapons.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:55 pm

hardly. the carbine and dmr are the same play style, BR as well. Sniper and beam rifle were the same play style. Shotgun, grav hammer and sword are only mildly different, but overall play style is the same. Rockets and FRG are the same play style except one has bullet drog. Sniper and Beam Rifle were basically the same. Plasma Rifle and AR were the same play style with different damage types. The only things that were truly 'unique' were the needler, plasma pistol and......mounted turrets/flamethrower.

I really feel the weapon criticisms are just looking for something to hate. Why not focus on the stuff that is an ACTUAL problem.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Ascendant Justice on Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:18 pm

Just a random thought here but, is it just me or is cortana pretty much yelling every line of dialogue in the whole game? Kinda annoying. Overall the game wasnt as bad as I thought it would be.

And now an idea with the release of the 3rd spartan ops episode.

I mean if they can create a campaign-esque mission by adding AI enemies & allies on a basic MP map like Ragnarok, why not allow US to do this in Forge mode? Add in enemy spawns, objective markers, etc. for our own custom games?

343 could release it as a "Custom Game Creator" for a small price for the public to build their own scenarios. This of course would become available AFTER all the Spartan Ops episodes have been released.

Thoughts?
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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:08 pm

that would be awesome, but unlikely.

Hell, you can't even do theater of campaign or spartan ops.

and no, she's not yelling all the lines.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by dragoon9105 on Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:33 pm

Its no so much the weapons are carbon copies i think its the fact that they could have done more with the forunner weapons.

We have the sentinel beam for example, which easily could have returned as the Forerunner assault rifle. For skilled players it provides a much better option than an assault rifle which has ridiculous spread, add a scope and now its a BR/Carbine equipment as well.

For a Sniper rifle the concept of the plasma pistol could have been taken and applied to the rifle, One simply holds down the trigger on the rifle and it would begin to glow bright yellow as it charged, then suddenly when released it does sniper level damage in a line.

For a Forerunner close range weapon why not have a portable shield that absorbs fire but drains battery the longer its up. If anyone is unfortunate enough to be in front of it when its raised they take shield damage and then health damage until they get far enough away. Balance it with a characteristic look (Like how the Energy sword is instantly recognized) and it would be relatively balanced.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:54 am

none of those ideas sound good. The sentinel beam was garbage, they even tried to fix it with the beam rifle and it was still stupid. a cahrging sniper would need to have no reloads and charge as fast as 2 shots from the sniper rifle and not drain power to be balanced. and that shield thing just sounds stupid.

but at least you gave it a shot.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Ascendant Justice on Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:04 am

Why the hell are we complaining about weapons?
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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Sat Nov 24, 2012 1:08 pm

cause people like to complain about 'unimaginitive' weapons when all 'imaginitive' weapons wouldn't make any goddamn sense. Not like halo can just have a lightning gun that shoots ninja stars.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Rotaretilbo on Sat Nov 24, 2012 1:37 pm

Halo CE seemed to do fine with somewhat imaginative weapons that filled similar roles without being carbon copies. So did Halo 2 and Halo 3.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by Nocbl2 on Sat Nov 24, 2012 2:41 pm

I still don't understand why the SMG was removed. They just moved the AR up and made the SAW, but they left the whole "high-power spray" out of the equation.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Ringleader on Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:53 pm

Rotaretilbo wrote:Halo CE seemed to do fine with somewhat imaginative weapons that filled similar roles without being carbon copies. So did Halo 2 and Halo 3.

This, I don't see how anyone can look at the Promethean weapons and think to themselves 'Yeah, 343 really aced this.'

Shoot, it ain't that hard to think of some interesting weapon properties, even a 5 year old could have spiced up the Forerunner arsenal...




Actually, how about this, The Prometheans are uncommon and significantly harder enemies that drop OP weapons, but since there are few of them, ammo is scarce, maybe they even self destruct or something, I don't know. They're Forerunners, so their guns should be quite powerful, no? Having the time and know-how to develop super advanced weapons. It's OK though, because you have your Spartan buddies to back you up, and both you and the Covenant are after them, so they can be a little OP. Here's some ideas I just came up with:

The light rifle could partially blind you (because it's light), or have a short, 'Reaper beam' sweeping effect to it. Or, it could have, like, a rainbow effect, SOMETHING!!! If it's light, it's like a laser I'd imagine, so maybe it scorches enemies, or leaves smoldering, smoking damage effects, OR, it passes right through them like the Spartan Laser (but with less damage)

The Boltok, I mean Boltor could be a semiauto pistol, or be like the Mauler in halo 3, or had something else going on for it. Maybe it should have projectile tracking, supposedly the Covenant got that technology from Forerunner artifacts, so at least one Forerunner weapon should have projectile tracking.

Gravity Rifle anyone? The primary fire reduces the gravity of enemy vehicles and units, sending them flying, while the secondary creates a mini black hole, or something.

The Suppressor? Again, it could've had the Enforcer 'red needler' weapon, instead of the same hard light projectiles:
http://screenshot.xfire.com/s/112267832-4.jpg
Slow moving, but voluminous, like the Brute Spiker on crack.

The Forerunner Shotgun could've shot out shockwaves like in the Transformers movies, maybe even a concussive effect at close range, so it trumps the energy sword. Like a directional grenade, it would even deafen you for a short time.

The Sniper weapon could've had the ability to shoot through cover if you had a lock on your target, maybe even pass through the entire map hitting everything in the beam's path. It is a super-advanced Forerunner weapon, right?

Finally, the Forerunner heavy weapon (and in my mind, they all should've been heavy weapons), should be the most creative, and unique of them all. Just let your imagination run free.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by KristallNacht on Mon Nov 26, 2012 5:54 am

Ringleader wrote: They're Forerunners

Did you even play the game?
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Nocbl2 on Mon Nov 26, 2012 8:22 am

KristallNacht wrote:
Ringleader wrote: They're Forerunners

Did you even play the game?
This.

Regardless, the weapons were still developed by Forerunners.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Ringleader on Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:44 pm

Yeah, so their weapons were developed by the Forerunners, who had the time and tech to make them not boring carbon copies of existing weapons.
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Re: Halo 4

Post by Vigil on Mon Nov 26, 2012 1:07 pm

Does anybody remember the weapons the Forerunner soldiers used in the brief flashback in the origin's episode of Halo Legends?

They used pistols that fired homing light projectiles that when fired in tandem with others would combine and form a wave of energy that sliced through anything in their path.

I could easily see that being a charge function for a solo pistol.

I'll admit, it's similar to the plasma pistol in design but it would be an interesting idea.

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Re: Halo 4

Post by Nocbl2 on Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:13 pm

Ringleader wrote:Yeah, so their weapons were developed by the Forerunners, who had the time and tech to make them not boring carbon copies of existing weapons.
Unless, perhaps,
Spoiler:
The humans are using human weapons.
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Re: Halo 4

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