Gun Control

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Re: Gun Control

Post by KrAzY on Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:14 pm

if you want lots of ionizing radiation you use a neutron bomb, those leave lots of fallout with much less explosive energy
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Re: Gun Control

Post by KrAzY on Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:17 pm

also, NT you are confusing "clean" and "dirty" nukes with a Dirty Bomb, which is a theoretical weapon that does what you described
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Lord Pheonix on Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:17 pm

I can't help but feel this is off topic in some way.

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Re: Gun Control

Post by Tylertlat on Tue Dec 25, 2012 2:38 pm

Lord Pheonix wrote:I can't help but feel this is off topic in some way.


That's what happens when the only person holding an opposing viewpoint on the original topic is British...
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Lord Pheonix on Tue Dec 25, 2012 2:47 pm

Well by being British his opinion is wrong right out the gate so I guess there isn't any need for debate.

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Re: Gun Control

Post by Gauz on Tue Dec 25, 2012 4:40 pm

Even if we can reduce the amount of fallout, the sizes of the bombs have increased meaning so has the size of radiation released. Nuclear bombs aren't effective in the long run.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by KrAzY on Tue Dec 25, 2012 8:48 pm

no gauz, that is a false correlation. the size of the nuclear yield didn't increase (much) it just became more efficient at turning its energy into explosive and thermal radiation as opposed to damaging ionizing radiation
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Re: Gun Control

Post by KristallNacht on Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:19 am

ntm we don't have to use the biggest bomb anyway.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Lord Pheonix on Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:34 am

Could just use the hundreds of thousands precision bombs we have to hit specific targets using intel from the battlefield like we've been doing. Working fine so far.



Just thinking practically though.

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Re: Gun Control

Post by Tylertlat on Wed Dec 26, 2012 9:24 am

iirc, wasn't the U.S. defense nuclear strategy more terrain denial than army destruction? Or was that just the Davie Crockets?
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Nocbl2 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 1:38 pm

The only way to win is not to play.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by dragoon9105 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:12 pm

Or be australia Razz
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Nocbl2 on Wed Dec 26, 2012 5:56 pm

Well fuck Australia.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Gauz on Wed Dec 26, 2012 9:57 pm

They're more useful as deterrents.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Rasq'uire'laskar on Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:26 pm

Incomplete ramblings:

I've mentioned that handguns are necessary for defense, and it's been thrown back in my face as laughable or a power fantasy. The reply is usually along the lines of "that's a job for the police".
When talking about concealed carry, many people think that citizens with handguns are a danger to bystanders, not the aggressor.

Handguns are ideal for defense. It's easy to learn how to use them. Unlike knives or martial arts, handguns do not rely on physical prowess.
My point: A handgun puts a 110 pound store clerk on equal footing with a 220 pound violent offender.

Of course, you need to know how to use it.

But here's the rub: until the police show up, if I am in danger, I am the most qualified person to defend myself.
I can't say enough good things about our police forces, but I wouldn't be surprised if civilians shot less innocent bystanders than police*. I think this is because police officers are often required to carry a gun, whether they practice with it or not. A CC'er is carrying a gun because they want to, and they probably know how to use it. Civilian carriers, if they get involved, are most likely to have been on the scene from the start. Not only does this mean that they can intervene sooner, but they have a clearer picture of what's going on than the police.

*Sadly, America doesn't collect data on this...

So, do 'Gun Free Zones' work?
Well, I don't think so. The vast majority of mass shootings take place in 'gun free zones'.
Are shooters seeking out these places because they don't want resistance?
Are shooters instead going to churches and schools because that's where their target is?
Are these places designated 'gun free' because they have historically been places where shootings have taken place?

I don't know. I do know that they aren't working. The only public shooting that has taken place outside of a GFZ since 1950 was when Congresswoman Giffords was shot.

A few years ago, when I was still attending a community college, there was this girl who had terrible luck with men. She had already been stalked by two ex-es, and she was afraid that another guy was following her. Once or twice, she asked me to escort her out to her car, because she thought she saw the guy's pickup.

I've heard of plenty of women who took control of their lives by purchasing a handgun and learning to defend themselves. "Oz" didn't have this option available to her, because she was attending classes at a university.

And, ah, that's it. Comments?
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Elabajaba on Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:01 pm

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/01/18/newly-hired-school-guard-leaves-unattended-handgun-in-student-bathroom/

Somewhat related. A Michigan school took the NRA's advice and hired an armed security guard. He forgot his gun in the student's bathroom "for a few moments" according to the school, but it was long enough for either someone other than him to find it and report it, since it doesn't seem likely he forgot it and instantly went back in to get it, then reported himself. If it was left in there for even a minute, it could very easily have been stolen had a student been going to the bathroom and wanted it. This is the problem of having armed guards at places like schools, as they can and will make mistakes that could have drastic consequences. (young kid finds a gun in the bathroom, then goes and plays with it and accidentally shoots someone)

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Re: Gun Control

Post by Lord Pheonix on Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:38 pm

That's completely right Elab, because of a single isolated incident where something could have maybe happened possibly they should ban all armed guards from school and fire the thousands of men and women that hold the job currently because of this one mans mistake. /sarcasm




I believe in the right to carry handguns and while I at first always think that civilians should not own assault rifles I think of the possibility of the civilian population having to defend itself from either a tyrannical government or from an invading force and how much of a disadvantage they would be facing with only handguns.


When Libya or Egypt rose up against their governments people around the world were cheering for them and praying for their success, but they wouldn't stand a chance armed with ONLY pistols. Civilians in America barely stand a chance against a military if they had rifles, snow balls chance in hell with pistols.


The problem with shootings isn't that the crazy man used a gun to kill people, it's that a crazy man killed people. Fuck the guns, find a way to get the crazy man. We take away the guns and they start using household cleaners to create fire bombs, explosives and IED's are we going to ban bleach from the households as well? Start finding a better way not to stop the thing the crazy man is using to kill people but stop the crazy man.

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Re: Gun Control

Post by Nocbl2 on Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:23 pm

Martial arts don't necessarily rely on physical prowess. It requires skill, certainly, in the same way an expert archer trains for far longer than an expert gun marksman. However, the main point of many martial arts is not to have power--rather, to channel it. Just going to say that. Otherwise, I'm all for citizens having firearms.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Lord Pheonix on Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:10 pm

Not everyone has the time nor dedication to take up martial arts and even if they did it's doubtful that the average practitioner would be skilled enough to take on a giant man or one with a knife or at least do it without injury the of being friggin stabbed.


When we think of Martial arts we tend to think of Bruce Lee or Jackie Chane fighting against Jason Statham or Chuck Norris, not Blake at the Tai Kwan Do school down by the Pizza joint who goes to practice after work.

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Re: Gun Control

Post by Nocbl2 on Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:24 pm

Just making a point. And I totally agree about your point on "the crazy man." We don't take steps to eliminate psychiatric disorders in our population, which are the source of this whole issue. It's also been demonstrated that they don't need guns. There was some guy back in the 80s or 90s I think who would mail bombs to heads of logging corporations because he thought there was a big conspiracy to destroy nature or something.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by KrAzY on Fri Jan 18, 2013 10:06 pm

the only reliable way for one person to safely stop a person who is wielding a knife is to use a gun.

knife attacks aren't like what they show on TV... they go more like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ah_0gia4A0
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Lord Pheonix on Fri Jan 18, 2013 10:22 pm

KrAzY wrote:the only reliable way for one person to safely stop a person who is wielding a knife is to use a gun.

knife attacks aren't like what they show on TV... they go more like this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ah_0gia4A0


I don't see Jim at the Karate School down by the burger joint who takes classes ever second weekend of the month beating that.



Now Jack who carries a M1911, he could probably beat that.

Jim, probably not.

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Re: Gun Control

Post by dragoon9105 on Fri Jan 18, 2013 11:36 pm

And Guess who beats both Jim and Jack



Robert (Robby) The Robot
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Re: Gun Control

Post by Nocbl2 on Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:05 am

As it happens, mech suits are totally legal.
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Re: Gun Control

Post by KrAzY on Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:13 am

I DO think that in order to own any type of firearm that you should be required to take a weapons handling class, and mandatory practice shooting at least once every one or two months. (the class at the VERY least)


you can't drive without classes, nor can you hunt without taking a hunter safety course. guns can be a good deterrent for violent crime, especially if lots of people have them, and all of them are required to know how to use them properly.

I have always been a little wary of concealed carry. in general I think it is a good way for weaker people to protect themselves. but accidents can happen.


Sam Harris had a good example he used in a blog post about 2 men beating up a person on the ground. you pull out your gun and order them to stop, but they ignore you. you shoot one of them, but then it turns out that the man on the ground had attacked them with a knife and they had overpowered him and were attempting to get the knife away from him.

a plausable scenario that I am positive has happened at least a few times.


so I am okay with concealed carry, but only if the people who get it have training to not use their weapon improperly (i'm not sure of the actual laws for concealed carry, so it is entirely possible there is already a test or something)
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Re: Gun Control

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